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Thread: Jointer woes

  1. #1

    Jointer woes

    I have a fairly new Delta 6" jointer. I am trying to jointer some fairly large boards to build a new outfeed table/workbench.

    The boards are soft maple, approximately 2" x 6" x 6'.

    I am consistently getting a cup on the side I am jointing. I have watched about a dozen jointer set up videos and attempted to assure the infeed and outfeed tables are coplanar. I have an A-Line dial indicator set-up and using it the blades appear square to the table.

    One of the set-up videos suggested lowering the outfeed table slightly to correct cupping. I have tried that with no apparent effect.

    I have not experienced this problem with smaller (lighter) boards. I will certainly state that the size and weight of these boards makes handling them on the jointer a challenge.

    Jointer wizards, I am open to any suggestions you have for me.

    Thanks
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  2. #2
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    Re: Jointer woes

    Jointing long boards on a 6" planer can be difficult. It takes perfect technique to get it right. How much cupping are you getting?
    Mark


    "Merely having an open mind is nothing; the object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid." G.K. Chesterton
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  3. #3
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    Re: Jointer woes

    I can't help. I may be the only man alive that can put a cup or taper in a perfectly straight, flat board on a perfectly tuned jointer.
    Cody

    "The reverence that the object maker has for the materials, for the shape, and for the miracle of his skill transcends to God, the Master Craftsman, the Creator of all things, who uses us, our hands, as His tools to make these beautiful things." Sam Maloof (1916-2009).
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  4. #4
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    Re: Jointer woes

    Yeah, Mark asked my first question, too ... How much of a bow are we talking over the 6" length?
    Jason Beam
    Sacramento, CA
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  5. #5
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    Re: Jointer woes

    I don't know how LONG your jointer is.

    I will ASSUME it is about 48" long.

    Make sure the tables are coplaner - at a zero cut height the infeed table and outfeed table should be as in line as possible.

    The cutter at top dead center should be in line with the outfeed table

    I am ASSUMING - you are jointing the EDGE - not the face

    Take LIGHT cuts - 1/64 to 1/32

    On the start of cut (infeed) - press down ONLY on the infeed table - NOT - above the cutter head

    Mid cut - Press down on the outfeed table - NOT - above cutter head - and only very lightly in the infeed side.

    It is VERY easy to apply too much pressure in the middle. If you place the 6' board on concrete so that you can see space in the middle - then press on the middle to see how easy it is to squeeze the space out - you can start to understand the pressure you must be applying - it is not much.

    You really want that board to run through the jointer is a "free" state. That means you are letting it get the high and low cut without you pressing so hard that you influence the geometry.

    BUT - you still need to apply enough pressure to hold it down.


    Long boards are really easy to bend by hand.

    Short board are NOT easy to bend bu hand.
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  6. #6
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    Re: Jointer woes

    Jointer tables must be coplanor over their total length ,not just at the gap where the cutter is. Take a straight edge that is as long or longer than total length of tables. Make sure the cutter and OUTFEED table are correct then, being careful that the straight edge is in contact with the out feed table its full length, compare the gap (depth of cut) at both ends of the INFEED table. They should be EXACTLY the same. Any deviation will cause a cup regardless of the when & where of feed pressure. It is the product if incorrect grinding of the tables. The only way 2 tables can be coplanor is for each one to be ground perfectly flat. Then they must be jig set to insure they sray coplanor.

    2 recommended solutions for your situation. If you bought the machine new, pack it up and return it. If you bought used (no warranty) take it to a machine shop with the capacity to make necessary repairs. I'd say both tables must be reground their full length and width as one step. Beware this could get pricey. Compare their estimate with the cost of another jointer before you make a commitment.


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  7. #7
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    Re: Jointer woes

    Are you absolutely sure that the outer ends of the tables don't droop?
    Delta translates as China and I have learned to be a bit sceptical against tools coming from that country.

    Do shorter boards get staight?
    If so the jointer is probably correctly set up.

    Leo describes the jointing techique perfectly. It is always difficult to joint pieces that are much more than twice the length of the outfeed table. They tend to become a bit concave along the lengh. Even on my 2,3m (7' 6") long jointer I run into trouble with boards much over 7 feet in length. Jointing longer boards is possible but not easy.

    One way to remove the concavity is to start jointing from the middle by carefully dropping the board on the cutterhead and then push it through to the end. Then turn the board end over end and start in the middle and push through the other end. That would remove more wood towards the ends of the board and straighten the curve.
    Be careful when you do this and make sure you have a good grip on the board over the infeed table where a possible kickback would drag your hands away from the finger-eating cutterhead. Also make sure that there is nobody in the line of fire at the end of your jointer. If you are careless you may get one hell of a kickback.
    Some people say this method is too dangerous. I use it now and then but only with care.
    Last edited by TW; 09-06-2015 at 7:28 pm.
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  8. #8

    Re: Jointer woes

    Quote Originally Posted by Stretch View Post
    Jointing long boards on a 6" planer can be difficult. It takes perfect technique to get it right. How much cupping are you getting?
    I am getting about 1/8" over 6'. I cannot get the boards to not have a gap even using several large clamps.
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  9. #9

    Re: Jointer woes

    Thanks for your reply and suggestions. Although I suppose I could bend the board, I find it highly unlikely. I am jointing the edge of a 2" x 6" solid maple slab. I can't bend it enough with four 3/4" pipe clamp to remove even 1/8" of bow between two boards.

    I have, to the best of my ability made the tables coplanar. I have used my A-Line to set the knives at +/- .003" different than the outfeed table.

    The boards are very heavy. It is all I can do to keep them flat to the infeed table for the first half of the feed and flat to the outfeed table for the second half of the feed.

    48" table on the jointer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leo Voisine View Post
    I don't know how LONG your jointer is.

    I will ASSUME it is about 48" long.

    Make sure the tables are coplaner - at a zero cut height the infeed table and outfeed table should be as in line as possible.

    The cutter at top dead center should be in line with the outfeed table

    I am ASSUMING - you are jointing the EDGE - not the face

    Take LIGHT cuts - 1/64 to 1/32

    On the start of cut (infeed) - press down ONLY on the infeed table - NOT - above the cutter head

    Mid cut - Press down on the outfeed table - NOT - above cutter head - and only very lightly in the infeed side.

    It is VERY easy to apply too much pressure in the middle. If you place the 6' board on concrete so that you can see space in the middle - then press on the middle to see how easy it is to squeeze the space out - you can start to understand the pressure you must be applying - it is not much.

    You really want that board to run through the jointer is a "free" state. That means you are letting it get the high and low cut without you pressing so hard that you influence the geometry.

    BUT - you still need to apply enough pressure to hold it down.


    Long boards are really easy to bend by hand.

    Short board are NOT easy to bend bu hand.
    Last edited by Froglips; 09-08-2015 at 7:48 pm.
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  10. #10

    Re: Jointer woes

    I just ordered a 50" straight edge from Lee Valley. I don't have anything to check the level across the whole length of the beds at present.

    I have jointed dozens of shorter, thinner, lighter boards. I have never jointed a 6' long board. I suspect with shorter board there may have been slight cupping that I just clamped away.

    Have Delta tools always been made in China? Never knew that. Bummer.

    Quote Originally Posted by TW View Post
    Are you absolutely sure that the outer ends of the tables don't droop?
    Delta translates as China and I have learned to be a bit sceptical against tools coming from that country.

    Do shorter boards get staight?
    If so the jointer is probably correctly set up.

    Leo describes the jointing techique perfectly. It is always difficult to joint pieces that are much more than twice the length of the outfeed table. They tend to become a bit concave along the lengh. Even on my 2,3m (7' 6") long jointer I run into trouble with boards much over 7 feet in length. Jointing longer boards is possible but not easy.

    One way to remove the concavity is to start jointing from the middle by carefully dropping the board on the cutterhead and then push it through to the end. Then turn the board end over end and start in the middle and push through the other end. That would remove more wood towards the ends of the board and straighten the curve.
    Be careful when you do this and make sure you have a good grip on the board over the infeed table where a possible kickback would drag your hands away from the finger-eating cutterhead. Also make sure that there is nobody in the line of fire at the end of your jointer. If you are careless you may get one hell of a kickback.
    Some people say this method is too dangerous. I use it now and then but only with care.
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